New Website just launched - paypal have pulled the plug on us

Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by Neil Lapping on February 2, 2009 at 11:26am

Hi Anna-Maria,

I fully appreciate that this is a major headache for you to be let down at the last moment but perhaps it is untimately a good thing as it highlights your need for bonding/compliance with the package travel regs.

It is a legal requirement to protect customer monies paid in advance and a significant expense for all small travel companies so it should be a high priority for any travel business.

I would recommend topp provided by Travel and General Insurnace Company (but I think I may have read somewhere that they are currently closed to new business.) They are a good option as you pay a percentage of turnover. So for small ticket items it is just a few pence. I think there is another company called IPP who offer a similar product.

Best of luck in finding a solution.

Regards
Neil

▶ Reply to This

Permalink Reply by Anna Maria O'Flynn on February 2, 2009 at 12:02pm

Thanks for getting back to me Neil,

You mention legal requirement for customers money but travel companies that are members of for instance ABTA do not get protection of their customers money? Or do they? Of course we have insurance cover for the company.. so we protect our customers that way. I will try topp and I will speak to the TTA again (unfortunately both offices are closed because of the weather conditions). I like the idea of paying a percentage of turnover this would suit us better. I will also speak to IPP and see if they can help.

Its a real shame that travel companies are being picked on. I originally went to set up a merchant facility with my bank at HSBC months ago and the very month (october) I contacted them to start the process they said they had this new policy in place and could only take ABTA members. Its been very upsetting to be with a bank for years, do your business with a bank for 3 years and then they say no. Why are we being picked on?

Anna-maria

▶ Reply to This

Permalink Reply by Lynda Woodin on February 6, 2009 at 1:03pm

Hi
We are also being picked on by Barclays Bank!! They told me if i had an ATOL license we would be fine which we have!! BUT now they want to see 2 months of trading first as we are a high RISK category "travel and tourism" !!
BUT how can we operate an on line travel company withourt and on line payment system ??!!!
With any luck we will also be able to now go to paypal??!!

Lynda
About U Travel

"

▶ Reply to This

Permalink Reply by Anna Maria O'Flynn on February 6, 2009 at 2:29pm

I contacted Barclay card who do allow merchant facilites to members of IPP which is another option. IPP is a different type of insurance and seems alot more cost effective than TTA and TOPP. You could look at them as an option but hopefully paypal is the answer although I still have my reservations with paypal as they really did let us down. Have emailed them about this article that Alex posted.

Anna-maria

▶ Reply to This

Permalink Reply by Alex Bainbridge on February 2, 2009 at 12:43pm

Hi Anna-Maria,
PayPal have historically been just fine with travel companies.

With TourCMS we have PayPal users in USA, France, UK and Australia (and I am sure a few others!)

We have a couple of UK PayPal travel businesses who are not bonded / insured via TOPP etc. Not sure whether existing customers with the same trading status as you are going to be impacted - or whether it is only new PayPal customers that are facing difficulties.

Full merchant accounts for travel startups have always been difficult. For one of those best to go the TTA route.

Welcome to SmallFishBigOcean!

Cheers. Alex

▶ Reply to This

Permalink Reply by Paul Hunt on February 2, 2009 at 1:36pm

Hi Anna

Your posting couldn't be more timely for us as we are having our website revamped to integrate with TourCMS's booking system and whilst Paypal granted us an account, (I made the application a couple of months ago and its not yet been used) I fear now that they may pull us as we are of same size and view as yourselves about membership and cost of joining ABTA etc.

I'm not sure we have any alternative solutions for you but definitely have a vested interest in following your story...

Paul

▶ Reply to This

Permalink Reply by Anna Maria O'Flynn on February 2, 2009 at 1:54pm

Will definately keep you posted. I'm waiting to hear back from paypal but I fear that they have said what they want to say. Latest email is because we are providing accommodation outside of the EU so maybe you will be ok. Its a shame really as all the products that we sell on our website are within the EU except for our accommodation in Serbia....So maybe you will be alright after all. To be honest I think they are just making it up as they go along at the moment.

I would certainly double check with them before you launch your website. We've had to take our website off the net for now, until we know what we are doing.

Absolutely fed up of being treated as second class because of the nature of what we do. I'm even to happy to apply to ABTA and pay their fees but our company are not big enough to join. Its a tough world out there.

A-M

▶ Reply to This

Permalink Reply by Dee Edwards on February 2, 2009 at 6:16pm

Anna

Sorry to hear about your bad day :-(

Afraid the credit card companies already stringent policies are getting even tighter, they don't really look at individual circumstances until you get through some other hurdles, they've had to pay out too many times. Looks like they are going to have to pay a lot more as it seems the people who had booked with XL through credit cards, the CAA is saying that the money should be paid with credit cards should get their money back from them rather than the ATOL fund.

Alex - the TourCMS people who are using Paypal without bonding or a trust account - are they just doing either accommodation or transport or both together?

If anyone is providing a package - which accommodation + transport definitely is under EU package regulations then they MUST have protection in place for their customers' money. It has to be full protection in all cases, for example someone who has an ATOL in place but nothing else only as protection if there is a flight from the UK involved, not if they sell a ground tour to someone who buys their international flights separately.

Anna - is the insurance you have in place for your customers to protect them in case anything goes wrong in their holiday, e.g. accident, or is it specifically to protect their money in the same way bonding or a trust account does?

The TTA sent an email saying they will be open tomorrow so fingers crossed for you. I think IPP is also an option, I believe one of their staff is a member of SFBO, Michelle Irvine. As far as I know, TOPP are closed to startups for now.

▶ Reply to This

Permalink Reply by Alex Bainbridge on February 2, 2009 at 6:45pm

The two PayPal / UK travel companies sell both accommodation / transport.
One is EU only, other is selling EU / North Africa tours.

You don't have to be TTA / TOPP / IPP to comply with the legal requirements (but this isn't legal advice).

Oh I wish this was less complex!

▶ Reply to This

Permalink Reply by Dee Edwards on February 2, 2009 at 6:51pm

You're right you don't have to be any of those...but you do have to have some sort of financial protection of customer monies if you're a company trading within the EU selling what's termed a package. It is very complicated *sigh*

▶ Reply to This

Permalink Reply by Anna Maria O'Flynn on February 4, 2009 at 2:32pm

What about if a customer was to book a bus transfer only on our website - would we have to protect customer monies then? Is it only when they book accommodation and bus transfers at the same time that it is regarded as a package. I spoke with IPP and they say that only when booking both is it regarded as a package therefore they would only charge to protect this element of our bookings and not every single transaction which is good news. However I remember speaking to ABTA awhile ago about this and they said that as long as you are selling both accommodation and transport you would need to make sure we were insured under the travel package regulations so I'm not sure if it still means that we will have to protect every customer or only those that book both transport and accommodation? This still isn't clear to me.
Alex when you say you dont have to be TTA/Topp/IPP to comply with the legal requirements, what legal requirements do we need to ensure we have. What is the minimum we need.

By the way Paypal have come back to us to say we can use their basic paypal payment system - the buy now buttons but not the intregrated website pro package which is what we wanted. Could be an option but still think i need to consider this legal aspect of protecting the company and my clients.

Any advice would be gratefully received.

Anna-maria

▶ Reply to This

Permalink Reply by Alex Bainbridge on February 4, 2009 at 2:46pm

Hi Anna Maria

Min requirements are to comply with the law (!)
http://www.opsi.gov.uk/SI/si1992/Uksi_19923288_en_1.htm
[Again, I am not able to give legal advice!]

Re paypal - we have been able to integrate the standard paypal into TourCMS - using the HTML code for the buy now buttons. So people can send emails to a customer, request a payment, customer clicks on a link in the email and makes payment, the payment goes into your PayPal account and the payment data goes into TourCMS (with customer balance reducing automatically etc).

You only need the "business" PayPal account if want payments at point of initial purchase (in the booking engine) (and thats because you need a business account in order to have access to the PayPal API)

Sorry for the TourCMS specific answer - but I know that if we can do it using the basic PayPal system, you can too.

Cheers. Alex

▶ Reply to This

• ‹ Previous
• 1
• 2
• 3
• Next ›
• Page